My Winter Science Experiment……….

Or I really would like to do something with this mare…..

I have a nice dun breeding stock paint mare. She has a long and drawn out life story. For the sake of argument she is a really nice mare, a full sister to the good gelding in the What’s He Worth Blog. Full older sister, she was originally bred to be a barrel prospect. I have started many young horses for her breeder, all half or full siblings. All the good kind. This mare would have been too…..But she tried to amputate a fore foot when she was a three year old. She wasn’t halter broken so she healed the best she could. Future soundness in doubt she was pushed to the back of the pasture for a few more years. She was given to me when her home was sold in a foreclosure auction. I brought her home, broke her to lead and tie, and sent her to a mule breeder I know. Heartless bitch, I couldn’t ship her, didn’t have time to ride her, wasn’t sure she would be sound, and the only paint stud in the area I have any inclination to like is her sire. I thought my mule breeder friend wouldn’t care about the breeding stock paint papers and would love her color, breeding, and conformation. He did. Unfortunately, the mare didn’t love the jack. Two springs later she was back in my pasture with no mule production record. Another summer has slipped by with me not making much time to work with her. I decided she would be the perfect candidate to test the NAHSC’s rescue solution.
I googled Midwestern horse welfare rescue facilities and eventually settled on the website: Midwest Horse Welfare Foundation, Inc. America's Alternative to Sending Your Horse to Market ... The Midwest Horse Welfare Foundation is dedicated to providing qualified homes for any horse in need. ...http://www.horse-welfare.org/find.aspx?show=state&state=Iowa, this website searches by state. Starting in Iowa, I emailed the listed facilities with this polite request:
Name of the organization or Ms.or Mr. (surname):
I have a mare I would like to place with your foundation rather than take her to the auction where she will almost surely go to kill. She is a nine year old dun breeding stock paint. She was injured as a three year old and is marginally sound. Perhaps with corrective shoeing may be sound for riding but she was unstarted by any previous owners and not halter broken until she was six, so although she is a kind, intelligent mare by nature she is a little different to handle. Meaning she needs to be handled by someone who has experience in working with horses raised out unhandled. She most likely will not ever be a horse for a mediocre horse person. I took the mare with the intention of using her as a broodmare since she is a well made and well bred horse. As you know the broodmare deal is not at all feasible these days. I simply do not have space for a horse I can't use or sell. Please contact me by email or phone either way on the decision you make about taking this mare.
Thank you,
Central States Horse Rescue was first on the list. http://www.cshr.50megs.com/. According to his website written in the spring 2009 he was full so I did not even email him. Next…..
http://www.hoovespaws.org/ was next. Reading this site, I wanted to add the mare had never been abused so she probably didn’t have the credentials for an emotional story to be written about her. There was a story here about an Appaloosa mare that would make Ginger in Black Beauty think she had lived a charmed life. I’m not writing this to belittle or critique the rescues in the Midwest. That isn’t my point. I refrained from any judgment or comment. I shouldn’t have given it a thought as she did not reply at all.
http://www.healingheartswithhorses.com/hhh/ replied: I am so sorry but we are unable to take any horse at this time, we are full at 25 and currently have 44 head on 25 acres. With the economy --funds are low and donations lower:-( You might contact Hooves and Paws in Glenwood IA or Iowa Equine Rescue in Cedar Rapids. I am just a small backyard operation and am pushed to the limits right now. I cant move perfectly good horses! Have you tried Craigs list? There are still breeders out there and the color is right
Sorry I cant be of further assistance, it sure is an awful time for horses.
Polite, honest, kind of what I expected, but she tried. Hooves s and Paws, back where I started……Craig’s List, isn’t that where those evil killer buyers stalk unsuspecting horse owners? Breeders, aren’t they the ones still causing the problem?
Lazy R at http://www.angelfire.com/ia2/lazyriowa/ was next and the email address in the website was kicked back as account unavailable. I didn’t try the account for donations but it does raise an interesting question.
I went back to the main site and tried Nebraska.
I started with Break Heart Ranch, http://www.breakheartranch.com/ and she replied: Can you tell me what her soundness issues might be, possibly send me a picture. It is possible I may have a home for her.
I answered: She was caught in a gate and cut her left front heal bulb down into the hoof on the outside quarter nearly cutting that quarter of the hoof off. She travels sound in the pasture but tends to limp slightly when worked. I have no pictures of her. However, here is a picture of her full brother. He is bay but they are built much the same. She is not broke to ride.
Thanks for your reply.
She replied: Where are you located at??
I visited her site also. I haven’t fed this mare for a year because I hate her. This lady had a sad story about the sad end of a two year old filly by her stud plus she had a black older stallion for “adoption”. The older stallion for adoption was described, ‘Yes, he’s a stud and he knows it. But he takes care of his riders no matter how inexperienced they maybe’. He may have been the horse who didn’t care if the kids hugged his legs too, I don’t remember, I stop paying attention at the mention of a grade stud taking care of novice riders on the trail. This shoots every scrap of credibility as a horseman a person may have had right out the window in my mind. I answered:
I am located at___ . I would like to let you know I will surrender this mare only without papers and with the agreement she will never be bred. I don't mean to be rude, but I believe very strongly if a horse couldn't hold its own in the open market for any reason then it shouldn't be in the breeding pool. I realize this may not be entirely fair or correct all the time but we have to start to unravel this mess somehow and one place is taking rescue horses out of breeding production. I also won't place her without stipulating if she is to become involved in one of those loony bin Epona/Phoenix Rising things I have read about she is to come back to me immediately. If that is an agreement you feel you or the home you have in mind can honor please call me late evenings at 000-000-0000. Thank you for your time and I appreciate your effort.
She replied; I appreciate your candor. One of the most frustrating things about rescue, is the fact, the law will not enforce that type of stipulation. I was told that after a horse is sold, surrendered it is "like a car" and the new owner can shoot that horse right in front of you if they chose, it is their "property". I went through hell trying to get one of my horses back, after a person violated my contract. That is where I found out that we have no legal leg to stand on. I have refused to let horses be adopted if there was even a small sign that they wanted to breed them, but I still had someone do it, and say it was an "accident." Signed papers mean nothing.
I thought I might be able to re-home her, but as much as I agree with you, there is nothing that is legally binding to keep them from it. I am at capacity right now. I do have a waiting list. I am sorry I couldn't help, but I can't even guarantee that for those I adopt from here, as much as I want to.
I stood up for what was right, when Phoenix Rising starved, and killed horses, and was slandered and attacked for doing the right thing by Epona and others. I have found out the hard way, that doing the right thing comes at a terrible price. People don't respect you for it, they attack you. I am sure you will do whatever is right for the mare.
And from what I hear through ABR grapevine, yes, she did. She was honest, polite, seems to genuinely care but that doesn’t change my opinion on the stallion.

The Best Little Horse House in Hastings http://www.thebestlittlehorsehouse.com/ replied: I have not been able to update my website as of yet, but we have moved out of Nebraska and closed that location for the shelter. Therefore, it will not be possible for me to take the mare in. I do hope that you find a suitable placement for her.
She didn’t say where she had moved to or if the already in stock rescues went with her.
Epona Rescue at http://www.eponahorserescue.com/contactepona.html was next. I received no reply to my email. Don’t worry after all the controversy, I wouldn’t send any horse there no matter what.
KTS Lone Cedar Rescues http://www.freewebs.com/ktslonecedarrescues/ replied:
Thank You for writing KT'S about your mare. I would like to call to talk to you about her, however, your phone number was not included in your email. May I get your phone number so I may call you? My phone number is 000-000-0000 if you would like to call me. I look forward to speaking with you about your mare. Take Care!

I won’t go all Fugly insulting with the reasons, but no. The picture above makes me think she might just be the type of person I was talking about in my original email. I will admit having some ‘not so perfect’ spots in my horse facility. I am not Carol Rose Quarter Horses by any means but……. And speaking of Fugly….where is the outing for this fine example of horsemanship? On a positive note, both horse and rider at least look happy and the horse looks fed.
On to Missouri:
Alder Hill Rescue at http://www.alderhillfarm.com/ contacts Craig and Leslie replied: I completely understand and thank you so much for caring that she finds a good home. We do have an open spot at the rescue as we were able to find a home for one of the horses recently. I have attached a surrender form, if you could fill it out to the best of your knowledge that would be wonderful. How does she get along with other horses (dominant submissive etc)? What kind of injury did she have? Has she been released for light trail riding by a vet? Has she ever been ridden?Where are you located? With the current economic difficulties and reduction in donations and adoptions we are requesting that all surendered horses have a current Coggins, UTD on vaccinations and wormings and a recent trim. We are also asking if the owner can help out with the gas to transport the horse. I hate to ask for all of this, but winter weather is here and we are buying feed so our budget is very tight. The expenses could be made as a charitable deduction to the rescue and then the rescue would cover the expenses if that would make it a little less costly for you.Please feel free to email or call me (000) 000-0000 with any questions. If you could send any pictures of her that would be great also. Thanks again and I look forward to talking with you soon.
If I were in a strapped position could I afford to have all that done? could I? I thought the surrender form was kind of interesting. I have sold horses for several thousand dollars with less scrutiny. I have paid several thousands for prospects at auction using less information than this.
*****************************************
Horse Surrender Form Horse Information:
Horse Nickname _______________________ Full Registered Name _______________________ Registration Association and # ________________original breed papers with signed transfers must be submitted with this form Breed _____________________Age _______ Gender______________ Color__________________Descriptive Markings and Brands: _______________________________________________________________
Current Owner Information:
Current Owner ________________________ Street Address _________________________________
City ___________________ State _____Zip Code _________ Home Phone ____________________
Cell Phone _________________ Work Phone _________________ Email ______________________
How long with current owner? ___________________Prior to current owner? ___________________
Reason for surrendering horse to Alder Hill Farm _______________________________________________
Medical and Temperament History:
Most recent vaccinations including date administered: _______________________________________
Most recent worming including date administered and product used: ___________________________
Does this horse have a current negative Coggins test? _____ (if so, original Coggins test must accompany this form) Has this horse been vaccinated for West Nile Virus within 6 months?______
Stand tied?___________
Does this horse load into a trailer? _____
Lead? _____
Clip? ____
Stand for the hose? ____________
Stand for the farrier?______
Stand to be wormed/vaccinated? _____________
Known unsoundness, lameness, or other medical conditions:________________________________________________________
Current treatment or veterinarian recommendations: _______________________________________________________________
Any known feed or medication allergies? _________________________________________________
Please list all known special needs, overall temperament, any likes/dislikes, quirks, vices, and any other necessary or useful information:
On a separate sheet of paper, please write up a brief (or not so brief) history of this horse. Also, if you have any preferences for the type of adoptive home you would like to see this horse go to, let us know. We can’t promise specifics when placing horses into new homes; however we do try to take into account the type of situation owners would like to see their horse go to.
Release:I , _______________________ agree that the above information is true to the best of my knowledge. I understand that by signing this form, I agree to surrender legal ownership of my horse(s) listed above to Alder Hill Farm. It is understood that the surrendering party shall hold Alder Hill Farm and all its officers, directors, employees, and volunteers harmless from any claims of damage, injury, or acts of negligence arising from this surrender. I have read and thoroughly understand this release of liability and agree to abide by it.
Owner____________________________ Date____________
********************************************
I'm not in the mind set to ‘pay’ to get rid of the mare. This same facility had five year old PMU “rescues” ready to be started under saddle. Five year old unstarted horses? Isn’t that part of the problem or does that apply only if you are pro-slaughter or a BYB being outed by Fugly? To them Fugly would say put down your beer, get off your lazy ass, and go ride those horses to keep them off the double decker bound for Mexico. Oops Forgot, Rescue Get Out of Training Free Card.
It is fair to say, if my only concern were to get rid of this mare at any cost I could have. But…….
The same concern keeping me from sending her to the sale, keeps me from sending her to the rescues. I ran out of patience before I ran out of neighboring states and rescues. The common theme, after all the pulp fiction and good intentions were stripped away I found little practical horse skill or ability to ‘upgrade’, ‘rehome’, or ‘rehabilitate’ any horse to the point of taking him/her out of risk for any length of time. The next owner induced crisis will find the horses even older and for all practical purposes in the same predicament putting them at risk to begin with..
Two of the rescues in this very short list have been ‘restructured’ or moved for some unmentioned reason. Where are their horses now? What about the adoptive forever homes they were to be overseeing?

By RH2

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!! You ARE a horse dealer!

http://forums.prospero.com/alexbrown/messages?msg=44786.1 As much as I'm trying to broaden my horizons, and write about subjects other than ABR (they're coming up soon, I promise) this is one I really felt I needed to address. I've been quietly following the many fund raising threads as well as the Rescue threads since the beginning of the year, and have found them to be very informative. When I came upon this one, I knew it needed to be brought up at the Ranch. I love some of the Antis-, while talking down the Kill Buyers, and the Dirty no good guys who run the Auction houses, they seem to have no problem doing a healthy business with them. We've already discussed the Broker or Feed lot business, and the money to be made. Here's something you may not know- there are Rescues that actually have horses held for them by those they call greedy murderers! Are these horses that are sick, lame, hard to place or older? No, sir! These are pretty nice horses with potential-kind of like the ones those nasty horse dealers would bid on. Kind of like the ones you or I would bid on if we saw them go through the ring. Check out any Camelot thread on ABR, and you'll find that most of the nicer prospects have already been "bailed", and often by Rescues.( An interesting aside, also note that more and more fundraising is being done on Facebook! These folks are not stupid. They see a sinking ship in ABR, and while they're not above using the loyal subjects as a resource to get the list of available horses, they go elsewhere for their donation base. Ahhh facebook, a whole new pool of suckers...ooops-supporters.) What really interests me is that when a private buyer comes along with an interest in one of these horses "saved" by the Rescue, the Rescue does not step back. They simply offer the person the chance to adopt through them, at the inflated price, of course. Which brings me to the above mentioned thread. Our friend Ponytales feels it is no longer the duty of Rescues to take in the horses that are neglected and abused. It now appears to be their mission to go to the kill pens and broker lots and pick up some nice ones, and turn them around and re-sell them....oops, again-adopt them out. Now, why, oh why does this sound to me like what dealers do? Our friend Ponytales assures us that the Rescues are indeed doing the noble thing by doing the worming, and providing the medical care and training a new horse needs. AHA! Maybe therein lies the problem. Back in the day, when a new horse was purchased, this was all the responsibility of the new owner. There were reasons for this. The most important was to allow one to understand what type of financial responsibility owning a horse is. Now, when a horse is "bailed" out for someone (unless the Rescue gets to them first, which is happening on a more regular basis), and all costs are paid, there isn't any real idea of the ongoing cost involved until the owner has had the horse for awhile. Once they realize they can't afford the expenses, it's often too late. If they were paying all along for the care and feeding, maybe it wouldn't be such a shock when the bills come in. The second, and equally important reason is that owning a horse is very much a "hands on" experience. For most horses and owners the time to bond is in those first weeks . When the Rescue is doing all of the care the owner should be providing, the bonding experience is lost. I can tell you first hand, nothing builds up the confidence of a new horse owner than being able to handle your horse for the farrier, hold him for his shots, clean out his hooves, and worm him. These are the most stressful situations, and if you get through them just fine, the day to day stuff generally goes off without a hitch. A horse that has been handled through these new experiences by his owner is much more likely to be at ease with that person, and will trust them all the more when other new experiences are introduced. And really, these things aren't all that big of a deal. If you can't do them, you shouldn't have a horse. For a Rescue to infer that providing these things are above and beyond is just a little silly, in my opinion. And finally, if people attended auctions and sales, there's a good chance that some of these horses wouldn't even BE in the pens. But thanks to the warnings of our Anti friends, it is looked down upon to attend a sale-unless of course you are a Rescue! It really bugs me that while the Antis campaign against people buying horses at auctions, they have no problem picking up prospects themselves and re-selling them. They talk about how awful and greedy the Kill Buyers and Dealers are for turning a profit on these poor animals, but now want to be considered as the "place to go" for a good horse. They've practically written an advertisement for why they're better than the very feedlots and kill pens they buy from. Maybe that will help weed out the competition? Maybe it's just me, but I fail to see the difference between these "Rescues" and the Dealers they look down upon. They're both picking out the best prospects. The Dealers may have the edge in the training area, and definitely in the honesty area, but otherwise the game is the same. Oh-I guess the Rescue cause is purer-maybe that makes all the difference!

By RH2

Canadian Food Inspection Agency - CFIA - horse meat.

While the CFIA does already have a list of banned Veterinary drugs in equine intended for human consumption, as I was informed in comments on anothe blog piece. They also have a list of approved Veterinary drugs and, coming soon, a list of Veterinary drugs for which withdrawal period will be required.
You need to understand that horses do not NEED any of the drugs that are on the "banned list". There are safe alternatives to those drugs and yes we could always go back to the days of good 'ol soap and water and bacon grease lol.
Some will have you believe that the list of banned drugs will be the end of horse slaughter or horse meat eating all over the world. This is just not true. People of other Countries eat horse meat without the attached guilt that anti slaughter people feel they should have, they want to eat horse meat and their governing body is not going to tell them they can't. They are trying to make it safer while still giving people the choice of sending their horse to slaughter. I think the anti-slaughter side sometimes gets food safety and inspection mixed up with anti horse slaughter antics. The EU drug regulations have nothing, what so ever, to do with animal rights or equine welfare and everything to do with human rights and welfare.

http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/fssa/meavia/man/ch17/annexee.shtml#e1

E.4 List of Veterinary Drugs Not Permitted For Use in Equine Slaughtered for Food with Canadian Brand Name Examples (January 18, 2010)
See full lists here -
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/fssa/meavia/man/ch17/annexee.shtml#e4

E.5 List of "Essential" Veterinary Drugs Permitted in Equine With a 6 Month Withdrawal Period With Canadian Brand Name Examples
See full lists here -
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/fssa/meavia/man/ch17/annexee.shtml#e5

E.6 List of Veterinary Drugs Safe For Use in Equine Intended For Food Production For Which Withdrawal Periods Have Been Determined With Canadian Brand Name Examples (Under development)
See full lists here -
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/fssa/meavia/man/ch17/annexee.shtml#e6
E.7 Frequently Asked Questions and Answers

Q1 Why should I fill out an EID?
A1 All equines which may be used for food must be presented with a completed and acceptable Equine Information Document (EID) at the time of slaughter starting July 31, 2010. In the event that the animal becomes unwanted, if the owner wants to keep the salvage value and salvage options with respect to human consumption of their animal as high as possible, they will need to accurately fill out an EID for animals they wish to sell.
Q2 Will all equine owners need to fill out an EID?
A2 It is not mandatory that all equine owners fill out Equine Information Documents for equines they own. The requirement applies to equines which may be used for food.
Q3 Why do we have to keep track of medication used starting January 31, 2010?
A3 Slaughter facilities handling equines in Canada will need at least a six month history of medication use for equine brought to the facility starting July 31, 2010.
Q4 When do I need to fill out the EID?
A4 The EID can be filled out any time before the sale of your equine, but it is important to keep track of medications used and illness occurrence during the time you own the animal, either on the EID itself or another record used to fill out the EID before you sell your animal.
Q5 How do I include pictures of my horse in the document?
A5 A digital camera is very useful for taking the required pictures. A little computer work can lead to a page containing the required pictures. This page can be printed with a colour printer. Alternatively, the colour pictures can be formatted or printed by many retail outlets which currently offer this service.
Q6 What are non permitted drugs?
A6 Non permitted drugs are drugs that have been determined should not be given or fed to equines which may be used for food. The list of non permitted drugs is available in section \l "e4" of this annex.
Q7 Is Phenylbutazone is banned?
A7 The use of Phenylbutazone in equines for medical reasons is not currently banned in Canada. However; Phenylbutazone is not permitted to be used in any animals that may be used for food including equine. (See Question and Answer 6.)
Q8 Do we have to keep a record of feed supplements or nutraceuticals?
A8 It would depend on the ingredients contained in the feed supplement or nutraceutical. Most feed supplements contain in addition to feed ingredients, vitamins and minerals which do not have withdrawal periods, so they would not need to be declared on the EID. Similarly, nutraceutical formulations of substances that naturally occur in the body do not have withdrawal periods. If, however, the supplement or nutraceutical did contain a drug ingredient, the supplement/nutraceutical would need to be declared on the EID. When in doubt, consult your veterinarian.
Q9 What is a withdrawal period?
A9 A withdrawal period is the minimum number of days or hours that must expire since the last treatment of a specified medication or vaccine (used as per label directions) before the animal may be slaughtered for food.
Q10 Where do I get the information for drug withdrawal periods?
A10 Section \l "e5" of this annex contains a list of drugs for which a 6 month withdrawal period is required. Section \l "e6" of this annex is to be available in April 2010, and will contain a list of drugs that are safe to be given or fed to equines which may be used for food. Withdrawal periods for these named drugs will be included with this list. With respect to drugs that can be safely given or fed to equines which may be used for food that may not appear on the list, consult your veterinarian for information regarding withdrawal periods.
Q11 What do I do about recording withdrawal periods for drugs my veterinarian tells me are safe for use in other food producing animals, but have no label instructions regarding the use in equines destined for food, or have a label statement that says not for use in equines intended to be slaughtered for food?
A11 For now, record the information required by the EID with respect to drug identification and use. Then contact your veterinarian and record withdrawal period information as provided by your veterinarian including the authority consulted by your veterinarian for establishing these withdrawal periods (e.g. gFARAD, veterinary college specialist etc.).
Q12 Are these new rules expected to change?
A12 Yes, these new requirements are only the first step towards strengthening Canada's food safety and traceability system for equines.
Q13 Will imported horses be subject to the same requirements?
A13 Yes, imported horses when presented for slaughter at Canadian slaughter establishments will be required to meet this new Canadian standard for equine meat production in Canada.
Q14 Will these requirements only apply to meat products exported to the European Union?
A14 No, these requirements will apply to all equines presented for slaughter in Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) inspected facilities.
Q15 Who will be responsible for checking the EIDs before slaughter?
A15 The primary responsibility for compliance to requirements in slaughter facilities inspected by the CFIA remains with the operator of the establishment. The establishment operator will be required to ensure each equine presented for slaughter has a complete and acceptable EID covering at least a six month consecutive time period before slaughter. The CFIA will oversee the effectiveness of the operator's ante mortem review procedures with respect to the EID.
Q16 Is it possible to include more than one horse on an EID?
A16 The EID represents the minimum information required prior to slaughter in an acceptable format. However, certain conditions may exist that would allow for multiple equine animals to be included on one EID type document such as holding a group of equines for a six month period with a recorded inventory control system. If common medical history, medication history and owner declaration can be made and recorded in an acceptable record format deemed satisfactory to the CFIA, a common EID may be acceptable. The CFIA must give prior approval to this record format and system prior to use. Contact the CFIA inspection services at the relevant CFIA inspected slaughter establishment for more details.
Q17 Are non permitted drugs not to be used in an equine presented for slaughter for the life of the animal or just for 6 months?
A17 The non permitted drugs are listed under Section E.4of this annex. Non permitted drugs are not to be used in equines intended for food production. During a transition period, the EID will be reviewed to determine if equines have or have not been treated with non permitted drugs during the 6 months prior to their slaughter. A longer "certification period" will eventually be requested.
Q18 If I sell my equine at an auction, does the auction become the owner, that is have care and control of my equine, for a period of time and need to fill out an EID?
A18 No, the buyer of the animal assumes the care and control of the equine after the last date of care or control indicated by the previous owner's EID. The final date on the EID filled out by the previous owner will be the date the animal was delivered to the auction premise in this case. Any medication use on the auction premise is to be declared to the buyer by auction management. Generally this information is given to potential buyers from the auctioneer as the animal is sold.
Q19 I am forwarding a previous EID completed by a former owner to the buyer of my equine; am I responsible for the information on that previous EID?
A19 No. Each owner signs for the dates of care or control indicated on their own EID.

I am still looking into any updates and specifics on the EU ruling about equine for human consumption and Veterinary Drug use. I was told that they would also have a list of banned substances, safe substances and substances that have a withdrawal period. I have not yet pursued this to find if any udated information or specific instruction has been released. So, while Vicki and the rest of the anti knowledge group would have you believe that the CFIA and the EU is on their side and anti slaughter she left out all the helpful information that they provided to the person who chooses to send their equine to slaughter.